It’s been almost two years since a large chunk of the original MST3K cast reunited for a new project called Cinematic Titanic. Over that time the group has put out a number of DVD’s, while performing a number of live shows across the country.
Initially the show was shot on a sound stage, with the cast on a set, and a few mildly entertaining “host segments” thrown in along the way. While it worked fairly well, and had some quality laugh-out-loud moments, it never really seemed to rise to the heights of MST3K, or even Rifftrax.
After a long period of no new content, they have shifted to releasing DVDs of their live performances, with their latest—a late seventies sci-fi reject called The Alien Factor—probably the most disappointing outing yet. If your live audience isn’t laughing along with you, it’s probably worth tuning things up before you put it up for sale.
But it’s often in failure where the problems become clear, and in the end it seems that Cinematic Titanic has simply sunk under the weight of having five clever people on-stage simultaneously. For the most part it seems like everyone is content to simply read their jokes at the right moment, and laugh a little when someone screws up, or manages a good bit of improvisation. Like an eighties super-group, it feels as if there may be too much individual brilliance to allow for real synergy, beyond a few solos that remind everyone just how well they can play their instruments when they put their mind to it.
In the early videos, the cast had supposedly been hired to participate in a top-secret research experiment (another take on the “Monitor their minds” wrapper from MST3K). Stripped of that minimal meta-context, the focus is entirely on making jokes about movies. And while most of the comments are funny (if sometimes a little too focused on obscure references to the seventies) what truly sucks the life out of the whole affair is that there’s never any of the banter and goofy running gags between the characters that I think is integral to the success of a great riff.
It’s the personal barbs, and back and forth that makes it feel like you’re hanging out with friends instead of being trapped in some kind of abstract comedic symposium on the structure of bad film The idea that the cast has desires and a point of view not only invites you in, but keeps you hanging on when the jokes start feeling a bit dry or forced, or the movie itself is dull beyond comprehension. Like all good entertainment media, it’s the narrative that saves the day.
It doesn’t help that the cast (with the notable exception of Trace Beaulieu and J. Elvis Weinstein) seems to be less enthusiastic than they were two years ago, and without their passion, it’s hard for me to have any.
I’ll keep my eye on Cinematic Titanic, if only because I’m such a huge fan of the obvious vision and talent of everyone involved, but I’m not sure how much enthusiasm I have left for the actual product.
It’s been almost two years since a large chunk of the original MST3K cast reunited for a new project called Cinematic Titanic. Over that time the group has put out a number of DVD’s, while performing a number of live shows across the country.
Initially the show was shot on a sound stage, with the cast on a set, and a few mildly entertaining “host segments” thrown in along the way. While it worked fairly well, and had some quality laugh-out-loud moments, it never really seemed to rise to the heights of MST3K, or even Rifftrax.
After a long period of no new content, they have shifted to releasing DVDs of their live performances, with their latest—a late seventies sci-fi reject called The Alien Factor—probably the most disappointing material they have yet released. If your live audience isn’t laughing along with you, it’s probably worth tuning things up before you put it up for sale.
But it’s often failure where the problems become clear, and in the end it seems that Cinematic Titanic has simply sunk under the weight of having five clever people on-stage simultaneously. Like a bloated eighties super-group, it feels like there’s too much brilliance to allow for any synergy, beyond a few solos that remind everyone just how well they can play their instruments when they put their mind to it. But for the most part it seems like everyone is content to simply read their jokes at the right moment.
Stripped of any of the minimal meta-context they had in the early videos, were the cast was supposedly hired to participate in a research experiment (another take on the “Monitor their minds” wrapper from MST3K) the focus is entirely on making jokes about movies as an art form. And while most of the comments are funny (if sometimes a little too focused on obscure references to the seventies) what truly sucks the life out of the whole affair is that there’s never any of the banter, and the relationship between the characters that I think is integral to the success of a good riff.
It’s the running jokes and personal barbs that make it feel of “hanging out with friends”, instead of being trapped in some kind of comedic symposium. The idea that they have desires and a point of view not only invites you in, but keeps you hanging in when the jokes start feeling a bit dry or forced, or the movie itself is utterly dull. Like all good entertainment media, it’s the narrative that saves the day.
It doesn’t help that the cast (with the notable exception of Trace Beaulieu and J. Elvis Weinstein) seems to be less enthusiastic than they were two years ago, and without their passion, it’s hard for me to have any.
I’ll keep my eye on Cinematic Titanic, if only because I’m such a huge fan of the obvious vision and talent of everyone involved, but I’m not sure that I have much enthusiasm left for the actual product.
Totally agree with your assessment.
The major problem is that Cinematic Titanic has all the feeling of “we have nothing else to do, so let’s go back to this.” And let’s be honest, after MST3K died the three most successful people from the show aren’t involved with Cinematic Titanic. Mike and Kevin had numerous books published and Bill has a number of plays on stage. All three have stayed in the business of “riffing” as well. Yes, Trace has a book out now (too late for any name recognition at this point) and Frank has “Cartoon Dump” every so often. But take America’s Funniest Videos off of Josh and Trace’s resumes and… well it’s sparse even if you choose to include Frank’s time on Samantha The Teenage Witch. And Joel’s “TV Wheel” was horrible, really horrible. There is no feeling of enjoyment when you listen to Cinematic Titanic. It actually seems as if the cast is imprisoned and having to watch the film, and in many ways they are. Joel’s flop at creating a second show, Mary’s less-than-stellar writing career and the entire team’s failure to recreate the success they once had on MST3K left them grasping at straws regarding their careers. Rifftrax, on the other hand, flurished. This can also be attributed to the fact that after MST3K’s death Bill, Mike and Kevin immediately started The Film Guys and, after they got closed down by Jim Mallon because of their work with Rhino, they wasted no time in creating Rifftrax. You listen to Rifftrax and it flows. Cinematic Titanic moves like a stranded ship with no energy.
Also examine both groups and their production of new material. Cinematic Titanic is sporadically on the road playing gigs here and there, releasing new DVDs at seemingly random intervals. Rifftrax has had a number of films shown nation wide in theaters (via live feed) reaching a much wider audience and Rifftrax rarely goes a week without something being released on their website. The boards are ripe with people asking when new Cinematic Titanic material is going to be produced and showing their frustration with the product. You can feel the energy in Rifftrax’s approach. Cinematic Titanic has the aura of a “final tour” and the board a rife with comments from people noting how tired the cast looks at meet and greets. Regarding the energy level one can draw a comparison to when Red Dwarf and Black Adder both produced new shows after an extended layoff of many years. These new episodes had humor, but the chemistry and flow that previously existed was lacking. Cinematic Titanic mirrors this. It isn’t like MST3K was (as well as Rifftrax) where the writers/performers were around each other all the time and knew how to work with and feed off of one another. Each Cinematic Titanic has the sense of the cast being thrown together after not seeing or talking to each other for weeks… and I suspect this is the case in real life.
There are other issues as well. Mary Jo and Frank should never Riff movies. One droll-sounding non-energetic voice (Joel) in the theater is enough, but three leads to narcolepsy. Both had individual stints on MST3K of being in the theater once and riffing, and while people loved the change in format the overall rating of their performances was mediocre at best. Also, Cinematic Titanic’s visual of having five people standing around the screen is an optical mess. One tries to concentrate on the action on the movie screen, but each little shift or hand movement from the silhouettes distracts. MST3K’s silhouettes took up little space on the screen. Cinematic Titanic’s only serve to obscure. People like riffed movies for the lines and don’t watch to see what the silhouettes do.
I would like to note I’m not trying to start a MST3K flame war here. But I’ve seen both and I prefer Rifftrax as they have a vastly superior product. Cinematic Titanic has very little energy (or humor) in their approach and presentation.
One interesting thing to note. As of the time of writing this comment Rifftrax has released “Santa Claus and the Ice Cream Bunny” to the public. It’s been lauded on boards as being as funny as one of the best MST3K episodes. Cinematic Titanic refused to do the movie and said in numerous interviews and Q&A’s that the movie was “unriffable” and wasn’t worth the effort. I believe this shows how little effort Cinematic Titanic is putting into their product and the art of riffing movies.
Mike:
Thanks for the tremendous and insightful reply. Lots of great thoughts, and I think you’ve gotten into some things here that really hit the nail on the head. And I think your point about CT’s shadows being distracting is and excellent. one It also may be a question of choosing the wrong scale, and showing too the whole profile instead of just the heads.
I also think we can both agree that despite our criticisms, we’d love to see Cinematic Titanic live up to their potential.
…and I also agree that I would like to CT become a sustainable alternative to Rifftrax. I guess if anything I’m frustrated with the final product considering the talent/history involved. It’s sort of the video equivalent of The Traveling Wilburys in that on paper it should work and flourish, in reality it is not. We’re almost three months since my original response and still there are no new titles being distributed and just the same movies being riffed on the live tour, thus the boards are increasingly filled with negativity.